Saturday 21 February 2015

Debunked: "10 of the Most Psychotic Quotes from Socialist Hero Che Guevara":


He was not Cuban, but he left his country to fight for the freedom of the Cuban people against the torturous dictator Fulgencia Batista. He was not African, but he travelled all over Africa aiding the anti-colonial struggles there. 

There are some however, who try to twist his legacy into something that it isn't. There are people on the right who actually preferred Cuba to be under the control of the old U.S. backed dictator, and hate the fact that the achievements of the Cuban revolution shine as a beacon of hope to the third world, that they one day will be liberated from the chains of globalised capitalism. There is also the pitiful so-called Left who reject Che's belief in violent struggle and guerrilla warfare as if to say dictators can be overthrown through peaceful means.

Ernesto Che Guevara is my hero because he embodies the true image of what a man should strive to be. He embodies rebellion and the idea that one should never be content with the status quo, that people should tremble with indignation at every kind of injustice in the world and fight with all they can to change it.

I was linked to this article by 'thelibertarianrepublic' yesterday, titled: “10 of the Most Psychotic Quotes from Socialist Hero Che Guevara”. I read it, and I am now going to debunk this complete and utter Horseshit.

#1 “What we affirm is that we must proceed along the path of liberation even if this costs millions of atomic victims.”
Che Guevara didn’t want an invasion of Cuba at all but said that they should be willing to use Nuclear weapons in order to defend themselves from one. Cuba was invaded but obviously no nukes were actually fired. Che did want retaliation against the West for the invasion but Fidel Castro convinced him against it. Funnily enough, what the article leaves out and fails to address is the fact that the U.S. was illegally invading and attempting to destroy the nation of Cuba. 

#2. "To send men to the firing squard, judicial proof is unnecessary ... These procedures are an archaic bourgeois detail. This is a revolution!"
This quote is fake.
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Che_Guevara#Disputed 
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Talk:Che_Guevara#Confirm_quote.3F


#3. “We must eliminate all newspapers; we cannot make a revolution with free press.”
Again, context is needed. This was said during a time when relations between Cuba and the U.S. were at their most hostile. All countries go into a state of lockdown when they’re threatened by aggressive powers. In the UK, for the sake of stability, we completely lost the vote during WW2, and the ruling parties didn’t fight each other. You'd also find yourself in prison pretty quickly if you started printing out literature proselytising for Hitler.

#4. “We executed many people by firing squad without knowing if they were fully guilty. At times, the revolution cannot be stop to conduct much investigation."
This is just a rehashing of the second quote. See the answer to #2.

#5.“The black is indolent and a dreamer; spending his meager wage on frivolity or drink; the European has a tradition of work and saving, which has pursued him as far as this corner of America and drives him to advance himself, even independently of his own individual aspirations."
This is one of the favourite ‘go-to’ quotes dredged up by the right to try and accuse Che of being a racist. This was said in 1952, before the revolution took place i.e before Che Guevara actually became “Che Guevara”. At this point he was not the hardened idealistic revolutionary the world knew him as.
In Che’s later life, he championed black liberation. Not only in Cuba, where he pushed for racially integrated schools, years before they were racially integrated in the United States, but he fought for black liberation in Africa as well. He left Cuba to fight with both the Angolan Peoples Liberation Movement and the Mozambique FRELIMO organisation against white Portuguese colonisation.

In 1965, during his visit to The Congo he fought alongside 130 Afro-Cubans and the all-black Congolese fighters. He also spoke in the U.N. against apartheid South Africa, which was at this time still supported by the British government.

African Liberation leaders have all spoke fondly of Che and his dedication to the anti-colonial struggle. From Nelson Mandela in South Africa, to Nasser in Egypt, to Ben Bella in Algeria; they have all regarded Che as not only a dear friend but an influential spirit. 

The attempt to mask one of the greatest contributors to black liberation as a racist by pulling up some quote from his youth is despicable. It is a shameful attempt to demonise the decades of black liberation struggle against racist imperialism and the outsiders who helped actively fought for it.


#6. “Hatred as an element of the struggle; a relentless hatred of the enemy, impelling us over and beyond the natural limitations that man is heir to and transforming him into an effective, violent, selective, and cold killing machine. Our soldiers must be thus; a people without hatred cannot vanquish a brutal enemy.”
This quote comes from his personal diaries. There are mountains of quotes like this from people who ride on a combat adrenaline. Here’s one such example from American hero and protagonist of the new ‘American Sniper’ movie, Chris Kyle: “You do it until there’s no one left to kill. That’s what war is. I loved what I did… I’m not lying or exaggerating to say it was fun.”

All this proves is that Che was a soldier and reacted to the same chemical functions that every other soldier does, which he was. He's not wrong either, hatred is a useful tool to be used in war. The difference is, Che Guevara fought to liberate Cuba from a dictator. The U.S. and Britain have slaughtered over 3 million people in Iraq and Afghanistan in a military occupation. 

#7."I ended the problem with a .32 caliber pistol, in the right side of his brain. . . . His belongings were now mine."
Contrary to what the articles claims, Che did not “accuse” Eutimio Guerra of spying. Guerra admitted to repeatedly giving away the location of the rebel position to the Cuban air force. The information given by Guerra allowed Batista’s forces to burn the homes of rebel-friendly peasants. The “belongings” Che refers to were the 10 thousands pesos given to Guerra by the Cuban government. 

#8. "Our technical comrades at the companies have made a toothpase ... which is as good as the previous one; it cleans just the same, though after a while it turns to stone."
I could not find the origin of this quote. However, I’d hardly say coming up with excuse to workers in an office counts as ‘psychotic’. 

#8 "My Nostrils dilare while savoring the acrid odor gunpowder and blood." "I'd like to confess, Papa, at that moment I discovered that I really like killing."
See answer to #6. Again, there has been much worse said from the mouths of imperialist soldiers.

#10. “It’s a sad thing not to have friends, but it is even sadder not to have enemies.”
What he means is if you’re not challenging the system you can’t form enemies, therefore if you don’t have enemies you are not challenging the status quo at all. Another great cigar-smoking, anti-fascist leader actually said something very similar: 

"You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life.” - Winston Churchill.

29 comments:

  1. Che begged the Russians to nuke the US during the missle crisis. When Kruschev backed down, he was furious. He WANTED millions to die for his dream. These are all well established facts. He also was a great admirer of Stalin and Mao who, between them, murdered up to 70 million people.

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    1. You guys said he killed 10 mil, then 20 mil, then 30 mil, now 70 mil? stfu. He probably killed 20 million, he was a terrible person, don't use a dictator to debunk communism, I could easily do the same. And Idk the source for Che liking Stalin or wanting to nuke the US.

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    2. The whole incident was started by US missiles in turkey anyways.

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    3. I've added up "the death toll of capitalism" which is just how many people die a year due to a lack of free healthcare, times it by 21 to show roughly how many people have died this century alone because of lack of free healthcare + how many people died because they where communist. 247 181 800 dead because of 1 out of many flaws that kill on capitalism, and capitalism hatred of communist.

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    4. add a 191 100 000 people that have died since 2000 due to starvation if you don't think the number is high enough

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    5. Keep your mouth shut, There is a reason for everything. He liked stalin because stalin was able to push the revolution with little to no potential after international revolution failed, He still outplayed his capitalist counterparts with a semi-feudal country on his hands. Stalin's 20 million death count was based off of rumors, guesses and etc.https://www.semanticscholar.org/paper/Victims-of-the-Soviet-penal-system-in-the-pre-war-A-Getty-Rittersporn/e2fe906c15cfefcdaca84d42c6e6fd51bc7b0a93
      The only cuban dissendents were slave owners who got removed.( Deserved it.) Yeah and capitalism kills 20 million a year and? Also when will we talk about the USA bombing cambodia or the middle east?

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  2. What's hilarious is that, had Jason Dunn ever come across Che in person, the encounter would have ended with a well placed bullet to Dunn's brain! The arrogance of Western kid's beliefs that they have any understanding of what drove the revolution is astounding. They would have been seen as a large part of the problem by Che, and I'm sure the look of confusion on Dunn's face just before the bullet ripped through his skull would have been amusing.

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    1. No idea what you're talking about at this point, making up scenarios that wouldn't play out because you have no proof he was a bad person or hated US civilians, he hosted Angela Davis, a westerner.

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    2. noooo che guevara will kill westerners!!!!!
      How delusional.

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  3. Wait...so you admit he did say most of these things, while excusing it with context or saying that US "imperialistic" forces have said the same things? So it's okay for everyone to say these things? If I say them now will you wear my t-shirt?

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    1. you ignored the context and meaning/tone behind them.

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  4. Go vist a socialist country, see the world you would create.
    Note that they do not have what you have, give up what you have. Emulate their lives; live socialism! Be brave. Come back teach us.

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    1. yeah free healthcare, no homelessness, vaccines, a better quality of life, vaccines coming out earlier, all that.

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    2. Yugoslavia under Josip Broz Tito, a communist. go look it up.

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    3. Socialist country? Yeah the USSR did outplay capitalist counter parts but sadly the USA took it down.

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  5. Jason, they have, over the past number of years, removed capitalism from another Latin American country, Venezuela.As you mention in your posting Debunked: "10 of the Most Psychotic Quotes from Socialist Hero Che Guevara" Venezuela is now "liberated from the chains of globalised capitalism"
    So, in the spirit of killing the Imperialist monsters of the world, do we replace them with the Venezuelan model of your socialist paradise? If not, will you so graciously provide us with your model?

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    1. Besides US sanctions, Them funding coups, and them constantly trying to destabilize the economy.

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    2. like Hankim said,"its like shooting someone in the leg, and being mad at them when they can't walk."

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  6. Some of the comments are defenseless despite any context, unless that context was the writing a work of fiction. For every defender of Guevara's wild rhetoric through the lens of partisan context, there are even more who out right deny his factual legacy or are blissfully ignorant of it.

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    1. Great double speak Joe....1984

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    2. TO WHAT!! to WHAT. the person who wrote it didn't even know what the left was fighting FOR.

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    3. I was talking about 1984, not the commenter btw.

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  7. So even Che's OWN WORDS don't count as evidence of his blood-thirsty nature? You can't defend him by just saying that the imperialists have said things just as bad or worse. This would be like trying to defend the character of John Wayne Gacy by claiming that other serial killers have killed just as many people or even more. This would not prove that Gacy was a good man. It would just prove that he is just one of many evil people in the world. Again you could try to claim that Hitler was a good person because Stalin also sent people to concentration camps where they died. That would obviously not prove that Hitler was an OK guy. Che told a London newspaper that if he had been in command of those nuclear missiles, he certainly would have fired them at the US. That shows the man was a dangerously unhinged lunatic, because only a psychopath would want to start a nuclear war to further his revolutionary aims. He was in charge of a prison with regular firing squads. Since, by his own admission, he really liked killing, then it is very likely that the stories about his cruelty are true. We know he imprisoned people for being homosexual.

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    1. Who did he kill, soldiers from the enemy he was fighting? Rapist?

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    2. Ah yes, People were trialed fyi, But rapists such as men with batista committed actions such as using hot rods and shoving it up a woman's genitals, they were lucky they just ended up getting shot, He was never homophobic, Castro was. After all castro used to be a former fascist.

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  8. I admit I don't know much about Che Guevara, though for this post I don't have to. I only have to look at what you've written and the argument you're making. And it's ridiculously childish.

    I'm with Jonathan Lewis. Your reasoning makes no sense, to put it nicely.

    I suggest you look up a fallacy called an "irrelevant conclusion", also known as ignoratio elenchi (Latin for "ignoring refutation") or missing the point.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irrelevant_conclusion

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    1. There is nothing irrelevant here, Taking quotes out of context in the other hand is an actual fallacy.

      I hate asian people they are dirty - Adam Bechtol

      boom, you are racist. you totally said this quote.

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    2. So when or where did I quote anyone, captain logic?

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quoting_out_of_context

      Now I see you've resorted to fabrication, and for what?
      How pathetic.
      No sense in continuing discussing in honest faith. Nor would I want to support this site with anymore traffic or engagement.

      Ironically you've clearly missed the point, about missing the point.

      I'll give it one more stab, shit for brains.

      Simply put, your "whataboutisms" hold no water. It's a false equivalence that you've pulled out of the same ass as the quote you flimsily tried to attribute to me ( A charitable reading would be you were trying to make some point, but god only knows what it is)

      It matters not how many other world leaders throughout human history have committed evils or atrocities. Yet you think you can take Atilla the Hun and Vlad the Impaler, other nations and leaders out of historical context to somehow try to validate you're little hero Che's assholery.

      It doesn't matter if I shot or murdered 100 people or if 100 million people did the same, or if Darth Vader did the same.

      NONE OF THAT HAS ANY BEARING ON CHE GUEVARRA.

      Nor does my hair color, or my favorite food, or the rain in Spain. The world isn't a big scoreboard of evil where one persons justifies another. And I really hope you someday learn to see that, since such ways of thinking are incredibly dangerous.

      I dunno if suggesting you read a book will suffice, but please, at the very least, aquatint yourself with these concepts below it shouldn't take long and will allow you to better construct arguments in the future.

      You fucking baboon

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_quoque

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_equivalence

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_wrongs_don%27t_make_a_right

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/And_you_are_lynching_Negroes

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